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The Modesty of Ramses the Great
Posted By: Charles Pope In Response To: Re:Em-Per-Ra (EL-REB)
Date: Thursday, 12 December 2002, at 8:23 p.m.
el-REB,
Ramses II usurped many monuments of his predecessors, including Amenhotep III. The reputation of Ramses II has diminished greatly as a result of this revelation. Probably Abu Simbal was an original work, but he could have expanded an earlier monument of some kind at that location. Why not? Is there any evidence of this?
The Sesostris legend is relevant to another one of our more recent discussions. Egyptologists do not believe that pharaohs ever ventured far beyond the Euphrates. Yet according to Manetho Sesostris "conquered all Asia in 9 years, and Europe as far as Thrace." But why wasn't that feat recorded in Egypt by pharaoh Sesostris (Senusret III) himself? Apparently, it was acceptable for a pharaoh to claim sovereignty over all lands, but not to actually describe campaigns of conquest in those lands. On the other hand, the strivings of the pharaoh in maintaining the traditional borders of Egypt was certainly an appropriate (and frequent) subject of monumental reliefs.
It would have been poor etiquette to depict the trampling of "foreign" regions with Egyptian troops. This custom must derive from the fact that a single family ruled the "world." In Egypt this family was Egyptian, but in Babylon Babylonian. However, feelings of nationalism were encouraged within each region. This protocol eventually broke down as military logistics improved and kings recruited ever greater armies to win succession battles against royal rivals. They sewed the wind and reaped the whirlwind.
It is surfacing that other pharaohs that followed Senusret III of the 12th Dynasty also followed in his footsteps. They were equally reticent in how they accomplished the imperial mandate and manifest destiny of playing God. We can deduce it by a synthesis of records that the same king left in his many principalities. But first we have to figure out what each successive God called himself in the manifold and diverse places called "God's Lands."
I think we will find that it was the first Cyrus (a.k.a. Psuesennes I and Cyaxares) who subdued the Scythians. I had not expected to address the Persian period in the book, but it is now unavoidable. I am fully convinced that there was a substantial overlap between the Chaldean and Persian Periods. Likewise, there was an overlap of Assyrian and Chaldean Periods. In fact, Herodotus does not even recognize a separate Chaldean Period. From his perspective the two dynasties were coincident.
Well, we digress. If there is nothing more to say about Ramses I, it might be time to start new threads on the Atef Crown or the breeding of "Clydesdales" for the service of royal rolling stones.
-el Rebuscaro
- The mummy of Ramses I
Oscar Calle -- Tuesday, 5 November 2002, at 5:45 a.m.- Re: The mummy of Ramses I
el-REB -- Tuesday, 5 November 2002, at 9:16 p.m.- Re: The mummy of Ramses I
Oscar Calle -- Wednesday, 6 November 2002, at 7:15 a.m.- Re: The mummy of Ramses I
el-REB -- Wednesday, 6 November 2002, at 5:45 p.m.- Re: The mummy of Ramses I
el-REB -- Wednesday, 6 November 2002, at 9:17 p.m.- Re: The mummy of Ramses I
el-REB -- Thursday, 7 November 2002, at 7:37 p.m.- Ancient Texts from Egypt
Oscar Calle -- Thursday, 7 November 2002, at 11:25 p.m.- Something is still Wrong?
EL-REB -- Monday, 9 December 2002, at 9:10 p.m.- Sethi I was Amenophis
Oscar Calle -- Monday, 9 December 2002, at 11:45 p.m.- Re: Sethi I was Amenophis
EL-REB -- Tuesday, 10 December 2002, at 9:56 p.m. - Hold on, Espere un momento
Charles Pope -- Wednesday, 11 December 2002, at 4:08 p.m.- Re: Hold on,Sesostris?
EL-REB -- Wednesday, 11 December 2002, at 8:52 p.m. - Re: Hold on, Espere un momento
Oscar Calle -- Thursday, 12 December 2002, at 1:27 a.m.- Seti, Sesostris and Such
Charles Pope -- Thursday, 12 December 2002, at 9:31 a.m. - Re:Em-Per-Ra
EL-REB -- Thursday, 12 December 2002, at 6:30 p.m.- The Modesty of Ramses the Great
Charles Pope -- Thursday, 12 December 2002, at 8:23 p.m.- Re: The Modesty of Charles the Great
EL-REB -- Thursday, 12 December 2002, at 8:43 p.m.
- Re: The Modesty of Charles the Great
- The Modesty of Ramses the Great
- Seti, Sesostris and Such
- Re: Hold on,Sesostris?
- El-Calle
EL-REB -- Wednesday, 11 December 2002, at 7:51 p.m. - Re: Sethi I was Amenophis, who was Rameses?
Ronald L. Hughes -- Friday, 10 January 2003, at 9:05 p.m.- Manetho’s Eighteenth Dynasty
Oscar Calle -- Sunday, 12 January 2003, at 3:55 a.m.
- Manetho’s Eighteenth Dynasty
- Re: Sethi I was Amenophis
- Sethi I was Amenophis
- Something is still Wrong?
- Ancient Texts from Egypt
- Amenhotep son of Hapu
Charles Pope -- Friday, 8 November 2002, at 7:16 p.m.- Re:Missing Left Eye
el-REB -- Friday, 8 November 2002, at 8:27 p.m. - Re: Amenhotep son of Hapu
EL-REB -- Tuesday, 12 November 2002, at 5:42 p.m.- Re: Amenhotep son of Hapu
Charles Pope -- Tuesday, 12 November 2002, at 8:20 p.m.- Re: Amenhotep son of Hapu
EL-REB -- Tuesday, 12 November 2002, at 9:12 p.m.- Re: Amenhotep son of Hapu
lluisa -- Tuesday, 11 February 2003, at 1:12 a.m.- Re: Amenhotep son of Hapu
Charles Pope -- Friday, 14 February 2003, at 10:00 p.m.
- Re: Amenhotep son of Hapu
- Re: Amenhotep son of Hapu
- Re: Amenhotep son of Hapu
- Re: Amenhotep son of Hapu
- Re:Missing Left Eye
- Re: The mummy of Ramses I
- Re: The mummy of Ramses I
Ronald L. Hughes -- Monday, 6 January 2003, at 3:15 p.m.- Re: The mummy of Ramses I
lluisa -- Saturday, 15 February 2003, at 1:35 a.m.
- Re: The mummy of Ramses I
- Re: The mummy of Ramses I
- Re: Set and Seth
Ronald L. Hughes -- Monday, 6 January 2003, at 3:11 p.m.- Re: Set and Seth
Oscar Calle -- Tuesday, 7 January 2003, at 3:45 a.m.- Re: Set and Seth
Ronald L. Hughes -- Sunday, 12 January 2003, at 12:56 p.m.
- Re: Set and Seth
- Re: Set and Seth
- Re: The mummy of Ramses I
- Re: The mummy of Ramses I
- Niagara Falls Daredevil Museum and Ramses I
Charles Pope -- Friday, 8 November 2002, at 4:05 p.m. - Another Article about the Niagara Museum Mummy
Charles Pope -- Friday, 8 November 2002, at 4:09 p.m. - Third Article
Charles Pope -- Friday, 8 November 2002, at 4:14 p.m.- Fourth Article
Charles Pope -- Friday, 28 February 2003, at 10:29 a.m.- Archaeology Magazine Article
Charles Pope -- Friday, 7 March 2003, at 6:30 p.m.
- Archaeology Magazine Article
- Fourth Article
- Analysis of Articles
Charles Pope -- Friday, 8 November 2002, at 4:48 p.m.- Re: Analysis of Articles
el-REB -- Friday, 8 November 2002, at 6:06 p.m.
- Re: Analysis of Articles
- Lineage of Ramses I and Horemheb
Charles Pope -- Friday, 8 November 2002, at 7:02 p.m.- Re: Lineage of Ramses I and Horemheb
el-REB -- Friday, 8 November 2002, at 7:52 p.m. - Re: Lineage of Ramses I and Horemheb
Oscar Calle -- Saturday, 9 November 2002, at 7:13 a.m.- 19th Dynasty Emphasis on Seth & Amen-Ra
Charles Pope -- Sunday, 10 November 2002, at 11:37 a.m. - "The Mother of All Fathers?"
Charles Pope -- Sunday, 10 November 2002, at 11:39 a.m.- "Bearer of the Name"
EL-REB -- Monday, 11 November 2002, at 6:35 p.m. - Amenhotep III's officials
Oscar Calle -- Saturday, 16 November 2002, at 6:07 a.m.- Three Men, or One with Three Wives?
Charles Pope -- Sunday, 17 November 2002, at 12:39 p.m. - Name Variants in the Tomb of Ramose
Charles Pope -- Wednesday, 20 November 2002, at 8:53 a.m.
- Three Men, or One with Three Wives?
- "Bearer of the Name"
- 19th Dynasty Emphasis on Seth & Amen-Ra
- Re: Lineage of Ramses I and Horemheb
James Forst -- Thursday, 5 February 2004, at 8:57 p.m.
- Re: Lineage of Ramses I and Horemheb
- Ramses I is back home
Oscar Calle -- Thursday, 30 October 2003, at 3:35 a.m. - Ramses Returns to Luxor?
Charles Pope -- Saturday, 9 December 2006, at 8:57 a.m.- "I once was lost,, but now I'm found, etc."
Ronald L. Hughes -- Thursday, 14 December 2006, at 2:44 p.m.- ... Was Blind But Now I See!
Charles Pope -- Thursday, 14 December 2006, at 5:32 p.m.
- ... Was Blind But Now I See!
- "I once was lost,, but now I'm found, etc."
- Re: The mummy of Ramses I
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© Charles N. Pope, US Library of Congress. All rights reserved.
