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Author Topic: The Maccabees and the Ptolemies  (Read 13170 times)
Sr. Member
Posts: 318

« on: January 23, 2010, 01:14:19 AM »

The below links are to the discussion of this topic prior the publishing of "Heroes of the Hellenistic Age" (2016):
« Last Edit: January 10, 2016, 02:28:42 PM by Chuck-Star » Logged
Ronald L. Hughes
Posts: 47

« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2010, 01:40:12 AM »

Chuck, can you in any way, connect the Maccabees, ( and you cannot ignore the "bees?") with the residents of Mecca?, or Makka, etc.?  Especially one family?



"Most of history is bunk"  Henry Ford
Yuya Joe College
Posts: 33

« Reply #2 on: February 21, 2010, 05:04:57 PM »


Why don't you give this one a shot, see what's out there and report back with some possible connections, families etc? My advice would be to look closely at the women in addition to the men. In a piece I'm researching about ancient queens, one of the names of Queen Shammuramat (the final and possibly greatest model for / incarnation of the Goddess Semiramis) was Maacah, and Salome Alexandra, foundational Queen for the Hasmonean / Maccabean Dynasty, likely emulated Semiramis in many aspects of her life.

If you can find that some of the descendants of Queen Shammuramat and her husband King Shamshi-Adad V (Machir) moved to Eastern Arabia, that would be a glistening path. Note that Queen Shammuramat was likely a granddaughter of Artatama / Isaac on her mother's side, her dad was Talmai, King of Geshur and her son King Adad Nirari III was sometimes called Absalom. The closeup names evoking Talmud, a key Patriarch and King Salomon indicate that this gal was revered in her lifetime and for centuries. The Queen of Heaven who inspired the worship that so troubled Jeremiah would have been a composite of Queen Asherah / Asenath / Ashratu / Tuya, and Shammuramant / Semiramis / Maacah / Maachah / Derket.

If you can find solid evidence that Salome Alexandra carried on the Maacah name in any way, then descendants of her and her Maccabean kin that moved southward would have two ways to associate the name Maacah / Macca / Makkah / Mecca with a community led and inspired by the Chosen People, southeastern branch (southwestern branch had already retreated to Ethiopia centuries earlier).

Go for it...


Charles Wilson
Posts: 2

« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2010, 11:33:34 PM »

This is a slight rewrite of some material that appeared on my old site (Now just a memory...) and Joe Atwill's site but it still fits right in where it should.  The Hasmonaeans were still a power bloc until the Temple Slaughter of 4 BCE and the Duplicated Passover of 9 CE.

Antiquities, 15, 11, 6:

"...for at the same time with this celebration for the work about the temple fell also the day of the king's inauguration  [[ Herod's ]], which he kept of an old custom as a festival, and it now coincided with the other, which coincidence of them both made the festival most illustrious."

 I believe that the foundational story used in the Gospels, especially Mark, is the Temple Slaughter of 4 BCE.  This is a story of the Hasmonaeans POLITICAL attempts to regain the Throne and High Priesthood.  There are a group of Priests who survive the Slaughter of 4 BCE and they see that in 12 years, their Temple Service group "Immer" is due to serve at Passover in a duplicate Passover Week.

They therefore "write" a story of their Second Coming in 8/9 CE to announce that "This time it will be different".

They leave Time Markers in some of their stories and you can verify these markers:

1. Hannah the Prophetess:  Luke 2.  She is a widow for 84 years. 8 - 84 = 76.  What happened in  ~ 76 BCE?  Alexander Jannaeus dies and the widow Alexandra rules in his place.  This is very transparent when you compare the two passages in Luke and Josephus.  Her rule also may equate with the "Half hour of quiet" in Revelation.

2. The exception that proves the rule:  GJohn 2: "...This sanctuary took 46 years to build..."  This is from the Slaughter. -4 +(-46) = ~ 50 BCE.  What happened?  The ascension of Julius Caesar but more importantly for the Hasmonaeans, this marks the death of Aristobulus 2 at the hands of Pompey's group.

3. "The Old Man by the Pool".  He has been ill for 38 years and sits by the Sheep Pool.  8 + (- 38) = ~30 BCE.  Herod does not get involved in the Battle of Actium and shortly thereafter makes the High Priest a Political Appointee.  The Hasmoneaens are not having such a good time of it.

4. and 5.  "Jairus' Daughter and "The Woman with the Twelve Year Issue of Blood".  These are the most obvious Time Markers and some time must be spent studying their meaning as Priesthood stories and as the making of Judah (And Israel!) ritually Unclean.

This leaves the "Woman Bent Over Double":

Luke 13: 11 - 13:

" [11] And there was a woman who had had a spirit of infirmity for eighteen years; she was bent over and could not fully straighten herself.
[12] And when Jesus saw her, he called her and said to her, "Woman, you are freed from your infirmity."
[13] And he laid his hands upon her, and immediately she was made straight, and she praised God.

For about 4 years now, I've been led astray.  Josephus gives an account of a few hundred Pharisees who will not bow down to Herod and Caesar.  Pheroras' wife pays the fine and Josephus moves on.  Michael Grant states that occurs in 6/7 BCE and that would put this event plus 18 years in ~ 12 - 13.

The above now makes more sense.  Herod opens the New Temple on the day of his ascension, combining 2 festivals into 1. You now worship God and Herod on the same day.  Also, the Pharisees ARE a hated group in this story line, represented as parasites and worms in the death of Alexander Jannaeus (Quartain Ague), Herod (I'll let Josephus tell what the worms were eating...) and the curious passage in Acts that tells of a ruler who sounds suspiciously like Archelaus in 4 BCE.

This clears up the outlier and unifies all Time Markers into a coherent story line.  The Base Story of the Gospels is the Story of the Hasmonaean Group in Immer and their last attempt to seize the Throne and High Priesthood.


« Last Edit: April 09, 2010, 10:56:44 PM by Charles Wilson » Logged
Sr. Member
Posts: 318

« Reply #4 on: April 05, 2010, 01:38:12 AM »

Hey CW, thanks for posting.  I really love your research (as you know).  Keep us updated on your latest insights.
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